Nanna is a mommy :-) - Paw Talk

Morgaine · #1 03-02-2009, 02:50 AM

We had our first birth yesterday and as far as we can tell everthing went fine. We can't really get a peek at the nest without disturbing them, so we don't know how many there are. But after 12 hours straight in the nest the proud mommy came out for a couple of minutes this morning. She looked tired (and thin

) but okay.

We are leaving them alone right now and are hoping that the babies will poke out their little heads eventually.

Question: How long can we leave them alone without having to look down there? I mean, if some of the babies are dead (gods forbid) we would have to remove them!

zoo20000uk · #2 03-02-2009, 04:19 AM

How hard would it be for you to look into the nest? I inspected the babies while the mum was out of the nest so I didn't actually have to poke around while she was there. They tend to wriggle about all the time, so I think you would probably be able to see quite quickly if any were not doing very well or dead. I found a runt in my litter and fed it with a syringe and kitten milk. He was very happy to lie on his back in my hand and let the droplets fall into his mouth. He's fine now but was so sickly he would have died. I was able to see more as my nest was more exposed than yours seems to be though. If it's just a case of being able to peek quickly and have a count up, I don't think it would be a problem. Just make sure you don't move them or disturb the nest. If she didn't think it was a good place to have the babies, I'm sure she'd have them out of there by now. Good luck and keep posting.

Morgaine · #3 03-02-2009, 06:50 AM

We really can't get to it without making a lot of noise. We would have to move 2 basement compartments to get to the back where it is and then move the actual compartment that is acting as a roof. I think it might be quite brutal for them. My husband is also concerned that the act of placing the compartment back as their roof would be risky. He is worried that he would drop it or place it wrong so that it caved in. As it is now it is stable and they seem content down there.

What's freaking me out right now is how quiet it is! We have hardly seen any of them since the birth started yesterday, they just stay down there. Does the mother not need to come up and eat from time to time! She has only been up once as far as we know, and I didn't see her eat. Is it possible that the others are bringing her food? Would they do that in a situation like this? They usually fight over the food

RodentzRule · #4 03-02-2009, 10:37 AM

Congrats to you, nanny and her little babys. Hope they come out soon, pics if you can!

Morgaine · #5 03-02-2009, 11:18 AM

I am crushed!

We found 2 dead degu babies that had been carried out of the nest (by the male we assume). Then we had to go in and check. So we were carefully removed what was in front of the nest and peeked in. We found 2 more dead degus. As far as we could see only 2 had made it and were drinking milk from their mommy.

We confirmed by looking in there that they have plenty of room in there and mommy could stand up in the nest if she wanted to.

So 4 out of 6 babies dead

I feel like such a failure for some reason, even though I know it's just natures way. I have been crying my eyes out since we found them.

When I have composed myself a little we will drive to the forrest and give them a proper burial.

I hope that when our other female gives birth her offspring will have a higher survival rate.

RodentzRule · #6 03-02-2009, 11:43 AM

That is so sad, i am so sorry for your loss, i hope you have better luck with your other mommy

Amethystbelle · #7 03-02-2009, 06:19 PM

Aw i'm so sorry for your loss

It is natures way and sometimes especially in a first litter it can happen especially if you don't know the degus origins etc... You can look pretty much straight away as unlike other rodents degus don't kill their young if you look mainly due to the fact the young are born so well developed its just advisable not to try handling them too much in first week or so to prevent stress. Just keep an eye on the remaining ones and fingers crossed for the other degu's litter

zoo20000uk · #8 03-03-2009, 02:29 AM

I'm really sorry about this...you must be gutted. At least she's still got two to look after and they will have a really good chance as they wont have any competition. My girl didn't really venture out much in the first day or two but, after that, she was in and out more but only for very short periods of time. I've never seen any of mine take food to each other but I'm sure she'll eat and drink when she needs to.

Morgaine · #9 03-03-2009, 02:56 AM

She is coming out a couple of times a day now to eat and drink. She started it yesterday after we removed the dead babies. After she had eaten the first time we offered her a dustbath which she was happy to accept. I had to fend of our male Balder several times (he is the most eager dustbather og the 3 of them, and will often return to the dustbath 5-7 times in a 5 minute span

). But she got to take a bath in peace and I let Balder have at it afterwards. After that she drank water and ate some more. And once again I fended of Balder so she could eat in peace.

We think the two remaining babies are okay. We have heard some moving about down there while all 3 adult degus where upstairs, so there is life down there. We will check on them later today, but we don't want to disturb the nest to often, so we are keeping it down to a maximum of once a day until they start coming out and about and we can check on them that way.

Keep your fingers crossed for the little ones. Nanna is certainly very protective of them and wont even let our other female Luna help any more. And forget about Balder! if he even comes near her she yells at him and he runs of with his tail between his legs. Not much chance of him getting lucky again right after birth

Morgaine · #10 03-03-2009, 02:59 AM

Oh, and another thing. A little piece of Nannas ear is missing, like someone gnawed on it. Could this have been the babies?

And the dead babies appeared to have been gnawed on as well which creeped us out to no end. Is this normal? What could have happened?

Morgaine · #11 03-03-2009, 05:20 AM

We just had a peek in the nest and the 2 remaning babies seem to be doing great. They looked healthy and even came out of the nest when we removed the boxes blocking the entrance. They had a qiuck walk around and then returned to the nest. You could almost hear them saying: "Is this the world, ehh... I'll just go back to bed then".

Amethystbelle · #12 03-03-2009, 05:31 AM

I have heard of cases of the parents gnawing on the dead young but there is no evidence or info as to why they really do this so far. It probably could be something to do with maybe cleaning them and trying to wake them, its just nature at the end of the day.

Morgaine · #13 03-03-2009, 11:14 AM

I am worried that the two adult females are fighting so much. It seems that at least 3-5 times a day they have violent fights because Nanna wont let Luna help her with the remaining babies. I worry that it will harm the babies. I can't relocate Luna as she is due to give birth herself any day now.

Any advice on this? From everything I read two females houses together should be a great help and work together to take care of the babies no matter whos they are. They used to get along great, I don't know what's changed

zoo20000uk · #14 03-04-2009, 02:49 AM

Has Luna got a separate place to have her babies or is she trying to use the same nest? The only time mine fought a lot was when one of them was in the vet for a day and the others were really nasty to her when she came back. I went through days of reintroducing and that was a nightmare. When one of my girls had her babies the nest was easily big enough for the other two females to get in with her and he babies so they never lost that closeness. If you can get a large nest box and encourage Luna to have her babies in there, that would be good. They tend to choose the best place when the time is right. Nanna may even transfer her babies there after a while. Other than take the basement arrangement out altogether while the females are nursing, I don't know what to suggest to stop them using it.

Morgaine · #15 03-04-2009, 10:41 AM

My theory was the same, that Luna was trying to get ready to nest and Nanna would not let her share. We went out today and got something that could act as a nesting box and set it up in the other end of the cage. Luna is building her nest there now and things have settled down; but not before they had a huge blow-out right after the cage was altered.

We finally had to remove Balder, he kept trying to have his way with Nanna by force.

How long until we can put him back. Luna is due to give birth within a week. Can we put him back in before she gives birth and then take him out again when she does? We are worried that they will reject him if he is gone to long. Any thoughts?