When do you know? - Paw Talk

Brittney · #1 08-01-2005, 06:04 PM

I know a lot of people say you'll know when it's time to put a dog down. My White Shepherd is nearly 14 years old. She's been having problems for awhile with arthritis and she does need pain medicine to even get around. Lately, she's just been really bad to where she can't get up and her legs have gave out on her. She's also had some incontinence issues. I don't think she's completely bad to where she needs to be put to sleep now, but is there really a way to tell when?

Purplebunny · #2 08-01-2005, 06:23 PM

I know what you are going through.. We had our family dog put to sleep 8 years ago, he was a basset hound and was 12 years old.. His back legs began to go and gradually got worse, he was fine mentally, but physically he needed help to go outside to go to the toilet.. We made the decision for him to be put to sleep as a way for him not to suffer anymore, and I still get upset thinking about him.. The anniversary of his death was last week, and my mum and myself had a cry over the phone talking about him..
You must think about what is best for your dog and not you.. I hope you do whats best.. Keep me informed, I am here if you want to chat...

Chrisanne · #3 08-01-2005, 09:23 PM

That's hard to say Brittney. Its a judgement call on your part. If it were my shepard (and i'll be facing this eventually), given the circumstances you described I would make the decision now. I could never see my beautiful boy not be able to get up and move about. That's just me though.

Good luck.

twostep · #4 08-01-2005, 10:08 PM

There is a book called the Last Chance Dog, by holistic vet, Donna Kelleher, DVM. The book is full of various cases but she writes of two- one is a german shepherd who went down in the back legs- dragged them behind him- he was incontinent too . she cut down the meat because it added purines to the joints and purines make the joints stiff, and she added things like glucosamine and chondroitin supplements and alfalfa tablets. She also used acupuncture and in five treatments the dog was running around.(www.ivas.org) So in deciding if and when to put a dog down one could also take into consideration that it may just be a matter of something nutritionally or healthwise that the dog isn't getting. Fix that and the dog recovers. It's a matter though of finding what the dog needs.

**Scarlette** · #5 08-02-2005, 01:23 AM

I think when you can see it in the animal's eyes that they are no longer enjoying their life, it's time. I've had a few animals put down. One dog was sick for months. I spent a ton of money trying to help him and when it got to the point that he was feeling sick more often than feeling well I decided to have him put down. I could see it in his eyes. He always looked sad and I could tell that he wasn't enjoying life anymore. As much as it broke my heart to have it done, I knew that it was in his best interest to stop his suffering.

You also have to take incontinence into consideration. Dogs don't understand the fact that they can't help it. They had an accident in the house and they're embarrassed and ashamed. No matter how much you tell them it's ok, they couldn't help it, they don't understand. My brother's dog had arthritis and became incontinent and everytime she had an accident you could tell she felt horrible about it. We never scolded her about it, we just cleaned it up and patted her on the head. She would hide for awhile, then come out with her head down. It was sad. My brother gave me the ok to take her to the vet for him on a weekend. He couldn't bear to do it himself. I was lucky though because the morning I was going to take her in I discovered she had peacefully passed away during the night.

Brittney · #6 08-02-2005, 09:10 AM

Thank you for thr responses everyone.
The reason I made this thread is because my mom said we're going to have to start discussing what to do with her. It's so sad because she's been here since she was 2 and I've grown up with her. I just had to put my Chihuahua down last year and it would be terrible to have to go through it so soon again. The vet just has the you live her so you know her quality of life better, so it's hard to not have someone to say it would be best too. Sometimes when I see her like that it just makes me cry. I just don't know, it's so hard.

Chrisanne · #7 08-02-2005, 10:42 AM

Hon, no matter how many times in life you may face a decision like this it will never get easier. You just have to trust your heart.

The vet is right, they can't make that choice for you. Morally and ethically it wouldn't be right.

Whatever you decide, and whenever you decide we are all here to support you.

twostep · #8 08-02-2005, 12:37 PM

Dr. Mallu , a vet in Sedone, AZ writes that dogs and cats have strong powers of intuition and can read our emotions and even our thoughts as easily as we understand words. If this true then pets would know beforehand that they are going to be euthanized. So anyone who intends to fool their pet by thinking that their pets just thinks they're going to the vet's for a check-up should realize that their pet knows what is going on.

You say that your dog has arthritis and passive urination issues. Have you looked into glucosamine and chondroitin supplements. They are excellent and within about two weeks, maybe less, one can see the effect. they work to rebuild the cartilage and joints. So does Ester C, a potent form of vitamin c. also there are pain relievers for people that also work for pets. One is called Arthritis Relief (Natra Bio, Ferndale, WA) is has only natural ingredients. It is for " : stiffness and difficult movement,or swelling and redness, pain in the bones and joints. Two tablets once or twice a day . You can see the difference in about two hours. also these testimonials:

Paralyzed dog recoverd use of hind legs "I must say before I received the Transfer Factor I was really anxious and I would afraid that my Ridgeback dog, Linkin, would give up. As soon as the package arrived from England I started giving Linkin 2 tablets a day for the first 3 weeks.
He has improved in leaps and bounds and it is hard to believe that some 4 weeks ago he could not walk by himself and could hardly move around at all. I had to carry his hind legs with a towel around his waist otherwise he just could not get around.

After two weeks on TF+, he started trying to get up onto his hind legs. It was difficult and heart breaking to see him struggle but he was trying. After four weeks on TF+, he managed to walk around even though he lost his balance and he hind legs would give way.

He is now walking and running around, although still a little wobbly, and he also tries to jump but does not always succeed. It is absolutely fantastic to see the improvement from week to week." Antoinette Kean , South Africa

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"My family has an 11-year old German Shephard mix that spent six days in a traditional vet's office because he could not walk anymore.
After the Transfer Factor and flaxseed oil, this dog is now walking, frisky and in good spirits." Richard English

According to the 4Life Company that manufacturers it :

1 to 25 lb. 1- 2 daily
26 to 50 lb. 2-3 daily
51 to 100 lb. 3-4 daily
100+ lb. 4-6 daily

Note: Some veterinarians start animals on a small amount of Transfer Factor Plus for 3 consecutive days and increase the dose gradually. The content of the capsule can be mixed with pet food or treats (sardines, cheese, etc.) Some pet owners find it easier to shove a capsule in the pet's throat or to mix the content in a little broth and use a syringe to inject the product into the animal's mouth. Although Transfer Factor and Transfer Factor Plus™ are best given throughout the day, satisfactory results have been obtained by giving the dose once a day. The 4Life company recommends to double or triple these amounts if the animal is ill in order to increase the efficiency of the immune system further. There is no report of overdosing on TF or TF Plus even when consuming massive amounts"

You can buy it over the Internet and some stores will carry it.

As for the passive wetting it can stem from the arthritis, once that's corrected you may wel find that it's been corrected too. Acupuncture helps alot( www.ivas.org) too, 5 treatments was all it took for one dog to recover. According to the vet he had the worst case of arthritis she'd ever seen . she cut down on the meat which added purines to the joints and made them stiff, she used glucosamin and chondroitin supplements
and alfalfa too. By the way, that dog also had degenerative mylopathy and was completely paralysed in the back legs.
There is also something you can give for passive wetting when it's not linked to arthritic /degenerative spinal conditions. PM me if you need that info.

"We can solve well over 90% of the all chronic diseases with simple, inexpensive natural therapies." Dr. Mercola

pihlaja · #9 08-03-2005, 10:12 AM

I believe our animals have ways of telling us when it is time to pass on, and I agree with Rhonda (Scarlette)--you can usually see it in the eyes.

From my experience, animals that are ready to go seem to lose all glimmer and liveliness from their eyes. The joy and happiness is gone from them. I believe this is the same with people.

If you feel your GSD still has life left in her, then perhaps you should consider pursuing other options for her such as a diet change or the holistic medicines recommended by twostep. However, I'm a firm believer that we should not prolong ANY living being's life if it is not meant to be prolonged.

I would recommended listening to your heart on this one. There are always signs that let you know when the time is near.

TNSWfan80 · #10 08-03-2005, 12:32 PM

hey,

i know exactly what you're going thru. my dog, Dugan, who lives at my folks house, i getting arthritis and losing potty control a bit now....my mom was saying that there's timees when he cant get up and times he gets up then falls over. but then he's fine and chasing the fly! it is hard.

she keeps warning me that the time might come soon....i think he's 14 also.
i wish we could take him off their hands, but we can't financially.

that is true about seeing it in their eyes. His eyes are cloudy, BUT there is still a sparkle.

i'm trying to get them to change his diet.

I agree tho that nothing's life should be prolonged longer than it's natural time... especially if it's for anothers "happinesss"....the best aact really is to just let it go.

I remember when i was 7 or 8, having to put our beagle, Thor, down. oohh, it was horrible. and he knew.

ok, i'm getting teary. lol.
keep us posted on things.

**Scarlette** · #11 08-09-2005, 01:39 AM

How is your dog doing Brittney?

Brittney · #12 08-09-2005, 09:36 AM

She's doing pretty good, atleast I think. She stays laying most of the day, but she goes running everyday. She even jumped for me the other day when she was so excited! Haha. It's just she can't handle walks very well, so I can only take her just a little down the road.

My mom seems to feel wrong to try to stretch out her life with trying to give her extra things, so any supplements and such I guess are out.

TNSW, I hope everything works out for the best with your dog.

Brittney · #13 09-07-2005, 11:34 AM

I think it's coming.

Today been a very bad day for her. Her back legs aren't doing good and now a front one. The pain medicine doesn't seem to be working either.

I'm really hoping this is just a bad day for her and tomorrow she'll be a little better.

Chrisanne · #14 09-07-2005, 04:30 PM

I am so sorry she's having a bad day Brittney. Sending lots of prayers your way that its just a "bad" day.

HUGS

***Dena*** · #15 09-07-2005, 07:26 PM

I'm sorry Brittney. I also hope its just a bad day.