-Photos- ADF - shedding skin or sign of disease?

[samarye]

The bottom line (up top): Whitey has had white knee caps and elbows for about a week and been (I thought) shedding small patches of skin. Whitey's legs are starting to look a bit red inside, I am worried (s)he might have some kind of infection. I want to separate the frogs ASAP if this is the case. If anyone recognizes this as an infection, shedding, or something else, I would appreciate the information.

Since this is my first post I apparently can't post images. The subdirectory of the album I created here with pics of Whitey is: forums/album.php?albumid=387 . I moved Whitey into a small empty tank to take these pictures; this is not the usual home.


Background/details:
Whitey and Blackie are 2 ADFs living in a 2gal tank (an eight year old helped name them). They were given to me with a snail in one of Brookstone's 1pint Frog-O-Spheres (the gifter was just as ignorant about their needs as I was or wouldn't have purchased the setup). The snail started pooping white stuff and soon died, so I finally looked up ADF care online.

I moved the frogs to a 2gal tank with an undergravel filter (should I just remove it and do 100% water changes?). I didn't attempt to cycle the tank before moving them but have been doing daily water changes of at least 75% of the tank volume. The local pet store said the water sample I brought in was fine for ADFs; unfortunately I don't have actual numbers right now. Their tank isn't heated but stays between 68-74.

Almost a week ago, I noticed that Whitey's skin had turned white over his joints, most noticeably his knees. I looked this up online and thought it was a precursor to shedding, but the white patches remain and only small pieces of skin are coming off of Whitey. Whitey's legs in particular seem to have been "shedding" the entire week. They've recently shown some red coloring. I'd like to know from more experienced ADF caretakers whether this is what shedding usually looks like or if it could be more dangerous.

Thanks,
Sam

[samarye]

I am sure now that the first frog is not healthy and have separated the frogs, but I may have been too late. The other frog living in the tank has developed white patches on knees. I am finding I don't have the money or energy to care for these long term. I am looking for someone else to take them, but I don't think Whitey will survive the search for a new home. I need advice about what to treat him with so that he maybe has a chance. Please help.

[Jess]

Hi! Welcome to PT!
I am typing this from a phone, so I can't see the pics... But it sounds like your frogs have amonia burn to me. Its pretty much when the ammonia levels in your tank are so high that it literally burns away their skin. In fish you will see their fins turn red and dissolve awaym since adf don't have fins, their skin is affected. For now change 3/4 of the tank and put fresh water in. You really need a 5 gal or larger tank, because a 2 gal is way too small for anything to live in.
Good luck! I hope yuor frogs get better!

[Sasami]

You said the tank isn't cycled so that means you're probably having ammonia and/or nitrite spikes. Either the frogs are being directly harmed by the spikes or the stress is compromising their immune systems (and therefore making them prone to infections). You need to do daily water changes to try to keep the water safe. I would also get the water re-tested and this time ask for the numbers.

Some other things that might help:

-Get a small hang-on-back filter instead of the undergravel filter. An undergravel filter only works in a cycled aquarium. Right now, yours is just pushing water around and not filtering.

-Get a few hardy (and small) live plants, such as java ferns or anubius nana. The plants will help keep the ammonia down and will make your tank cycle faster.

-Get a bigger tank. A 2-gallon is kinda small for two frogs. At this point you might as well put them together, by the way, since they're both sick. A 5-gallon would be ideal.

Good luck and please keep us updated!

[steelThread]

I need help with my fish/frog tank. I have 4 Glofish, which are really Zebra Danios, and 4 African Dwarf Frogs. I have a filter, heater, and a bubble wand. Ever since I put in the Glofish, filter, and bubble wand the frogs have not moved much. I also haven't seen them come up for water in a while. Anyways the ADFs have been hanging out around the bubble wand and near the opening on the filter tube. Are my ADF going to be alright?

I also feed them pellets. I got the frogs from the Brookestone Frog-O-Sphere package and then decided to get 2 more and upgrade the tank. The tank is a Marineland Eclipse System Six and I just raised the water level more than half of what it was before. Are my frogs just getting used to their new enviroment? Please help.

[Sasami]

Quote: Originally Posted by steelThread I need help with my fish/frog tank. I have 4 Glofish, which are really Zebra Danios, and 4 African Dwarf Frogs. I have a filter, heater, and a bubble wand. Ever since I put in the Glofish, filter, and bubble wand the frogs have not moved much. I also haven't seen them come up for water in a while. Anyways the ADFs have been hanging out around the bubble wand and near the opening on the filter tube. Are my ADF going to be alright? I also feed them pellets. I got the frogs from the Brookestone Frog-O-Sphere package and then decided to get 2 more and upgrade the tank. The tank is a Marineland Eclipse System Six and I just raised the water level more than half of what it was before. Are my frogs just getting used to their new enviroment? Please help.

First off, instead of posting to older threads, try making your own topics. You'll get more responses that way .

Your aquarium is over-stocked. Those animals should have at least 10-gallons worth of space and 20-gallons would be far better (it's normally recommended that zebra danios aren't confined to anything smaller than a 20-gallon because of their need to school and activity levels).

If you can't upgrade your tank, I'd recommend bringing the fish back and sticking to the frogs since that tank would be fine for four ADFs . Honestly, it can be a pain to mix frogs and fish anyway. The ADFs can get nippy and they also may have trouble getting enough food since the fish eat so fast.

It also sounds like the tank wasn't cycled first. A brand new aquarium doesn't have enough beneficial bacteria to support so many animals. Most likely you're going to end up with ammonia spikes (ammonia is very toxic).

This is what I would suggest:

-Bring the fish back.

-Do a large water change (not a full water change) and use something like Prime as your water conditioner (Prime is handy because it can detoxify/remove harmful contaminants).

-Add Tetra SmartStart/BioSpira to instantly cycle the aquarium. If you still have the original gravel from the old tank and it hasn't dried out, add some to the new tank. If you can't find any products to help cycle your aquarium, you're just going to have to do daily small water changes and hope for the best (in addition to regular water testing to watch your ammonia and nitrite levels). Live plants help a ton but be careful and make sure you buy plants that are actually aquatic. Java ferns, dwarf anubias, and water sprite are some hardy plants.

-Get your water tested. This can be done for free at most pet stores.

If you absolutely cannot or don't want to bring the fish back, you're going to need a much larger aquarium. I, personally, wouldn't mix such active fish with frogs, though. Zebra danios are extremely fast and boisterous when it comes to getting food and their constant movement is going to stress a lot of frogs out.

Good luck! Oh, and as far as food goes, ADFs love frozen and live foods such as bloodworms, brine shrimp, krill, ghost shrimp, etc.

[steelThread]

Thanks

[pseudorocknroll]

samarye---

I recently had an ammonia outbreak as well! To make sure it IS ammonia go to your local pet store and buy an, "API MASTER TEST KIT" If so, water changes will be your best friend. If after testing your ammonia if it's at a 1 or a 2 you must do a 90% water change. Continue to do 50% water changes every day until you notice the ammonia has gone down.

--What are you using as your water conditioner? PRIME is a great choice (especially during emergencies like this).

Also, I highly recommend pedialyte baths. They are AMAZING and saved my ADF's life. Move your frogs into a never-touched-soap bowl and do 10 parts water to 1 part NON FLAVORED pedialyte. Let both of your frogs soak for 1-2 hours (2 hours MAX)

HANG IN THERE!