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post #16 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-17-2011, 09:14 PM
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I think what he meant was if you're going to feed your pet healthy food, atleast let it be something they particularly enjoy eating. If they are extremely picky to the point where they reject all quality diets then ou need to compensate in a healthy way. None of my hamsters like mazuri, so I grind it up and powder it all in their seed mix, fruits, veggies and protien foods. I simply measure the appropriate amount of mazuri per bowl and do it that way. They eat it every time without even knowing it. I agree with him somewhat, if your pet hates the food then look for something else of the same quality to compromise. I don't think he meant feed them whatever you want.


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post #17 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 02:33 AM
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sorry, not you. I was responding to the above post by uro when he said to give them what they liked. Obviously, you're demonstrating the importance of reading the ingredients and then matching that to the picky one. I apolgize to the harshness of my above post uro, but sometimes I get blunt.. Especially when I got a few in me!
Purple-Hops: I'm sorry, but that's not what I meant. I would never knowingly feed an animal food that was unhealthy or harmful. I can tell that you care for your animals, and some of the other posters seem to know just what to feed hamsters. PetSmart and Petco have ways to look up ingredients on various pet foods, and they offer reviews. I will say one thing that I know of that is unhealthy. There are treats that are made specifically for small animals that are loaded with sugar such as yogurt treats, granola bars, etc.
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post #18 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 03:21 AM Thread Starter
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oh yeah the treat sticks are DEF a now and then things and hams should almost never have yogurt drops. Especially dwarfs. I use this critter cravin's treat mix for my syrian. My bf's mom got it for my ham when she had her litter. generally I dont do treats now and then i'll give them a piece of lean meat ( very small) or something natural as a treat. My Kodi loves his dog food as a treat lol ( VERY good quality dog food ) both of my hams love it. some are against it but with dwarfs having so little they can really safely eat as well as keeping their teeth trim I found it to be a very good solution. natural treats like plain yogurt or a tiny piece of fruit is best. usually with my hams instead of treats I offer a mazuri pellet for sadi ( even though I have the bag of treats) and for Kodi a piece of dog food. They get treats less than once a week though

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post #19 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 04:38 AM
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You should never feed rodents dog or cat food as they are high in fat and protien made for strict carnivores, I told you that in the other forum but hey why believe a Breeder/Vet tech/wildlife Rehabilitator? Rodents need fiber and vegetarian protiens with often lean meaty/dairy/nut protiens. They need fruits and vegetables, seeds, nuts, plants and vitamins/minerals aswell. Stop feeding them dog/cat food! It affects their livers due to the INCORRECT diet and nutrition. You are wasting their energy on nutrients they don't need/use or would ever depend on in the wild. Never feed an animal food that is not made for their species...

And FYI, yogurt treats are perfectly fine, they need to just be given in moderation like many other foods.

Hamsters have EXTREMELY sensitive tummies -_-

Also just Mazuri is not enough Nutrition for a Hamster of any Species. You have to add seed mix because it's part of their diet along with other things. It doesn't matter if you think she is picky, Seed Mix is natural and always eaten/enjoyed by All hamsters. There is no way your Sadi doesn't eat seeds, that is literally impossible. If you aren't willing to provide a healthy diet of all the food groups they require then don't own a Hamster. Simply having one or two "Healthy" foods is not enough, you need to balance it, that doesn't make it "okay". So yea, you got the Pellets where is the rest of their food besides the Fruits/vegetables? They are rodents for crying out loud, they need grains and seeds in most of their total diet in order to maintain a healthy body/lifestyle.


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Last edited by Lacrima; 06-18-2011 at 05:11 AM.
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post #20 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 12:09 PM
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Hey now, be civil please.


I'm sure elli feeds them a variety of foods. If a hamster develops a particular fancy diet and gets spoiled off it then it might just look for that food. I fed my hamsters everything, they are omnivores and will eat bugs and stuff. My hamsters all lived to be 2.5-3.5 yrs on a varied diet containing stuff from all food groups. I actually stopped buying commercial hamster food and bought, instead, mixed seeds etc from bulk barn. As for yogurt treats, hamsters can eat them, yes. What uro was saying was that they should be fed in moderation bc of the high sugar content. And IMO, when people are uptight about keeping their pets on a strict and limited diet the pet develops allergies and stomach sensitivites. Like I said, I had hamsters my entire life up until Button (about 3 yrs ago) and I always introduced variation, meats (protein alternatives), and sugars. Everything in moderation kept them strong and healthy until they passed on. There's no need to attack someone based on their particular dieting sched. Everyone has different resources and opinions available.
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post #21 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 12:18 PM
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Hey now, be civil please.


I'm sure elli feeds them a variety of foods. If a hamster develops a particular fancy diet and gets spoiled off it then it might just look for that food. I fed my hamsters everything, they are omnivores and will eat bugs and stuff. My hamsters all lived to be 2.5-3.5 yrs on a varied diet containing stuff from all food groups. I actually stopped buying commercial hamster food and bought, instead, mixed seeds etc from bulk barn. As for yogurt treats, hamsters can eat them, yes. What uro was saying was that they should be fed in moderation bc of the high sugar content. And IMO, when people are uptight about keeping their pets on a strict and limited diet the pet develops allergies and stomach sensitivites. Like I said, I had hamsters my entire life up until Button (about 3 yrs ago) and I always introduced variation, meats (protein alternatives), and sugars. Everything in moderation kept them strong and healthy until they passed on. There's no need to attack someone based on their particular dieting sched. Everyone has different resources and opinions available.
I didn't mean it to be "attacking" but she and I had this conversation many times, and there is another thread in another forum talking about that specific diet and why dog food and cat food shouldn't be used because it contains no nutritional value except excess fats and unhealthy proteins (For their species that is).

It's just agitation, after trying to help somebody and they literally say the same thing somewhere else pretending they never learned anything from the first encounter that's all. 3-4 pieces of food made for strict carnivores every few days is way too much.


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post #22 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 04:10 PM
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3-4 pieces of food made for strict carnivores every few days is way too much.

I think you meant that the other way around?? lol 3-4 peieces of dog food for a strict vegetarian perhaps?! lol I'm confused.
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post #23 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 09:37 PM
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I agree that cat and dog food is a bad idea for rodents, because of the additives that may be bad for them, and because it is specifically formulated for cats and dogs. Can you please give me a reputable source that says dry cat and dog food is okay to feed rodents?
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post #24 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-18-2011, 11:26 PM
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I think you meant that the other way around?? lol 3-4 peieces of dog food for a strict vegetarian perhaps?! lol I'm confused.
Sorry I didn't say it right haha, 3-4 pieces of food meant for strict carnivores is too much to be feeding a rodent - as rodent have a completely different diet.


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post #25 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-19-2011, 07:08 AM
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http://www.hamsterific.com/nutrition.cfm I wouldn't say this is necessarily reputable but it makes sense to me. There is no correct one diet for every hamster. What I said was that hamsters, and most animals, need need need variation in their diet to acheive a healthy pet. I never kept my pets on 1 diet forever. Bunnies have sensitive tracts and with mine I keep 1 pellet brand and mix in different hays veggies and fruits. It keeps them interested and happy.

I may not recommend dog treats every day but biweekly or so 1 biscuit or a couple kibbles won't kill the hamster. It adds a different protein source than does legumes and dried beans. Since hamsters should not be fed large amounts of lettuces, biscuits contain iron and calcium in a safe dose. And I have never owned dwarves but they are apparantly prone to diabetes so special precaution should be taken. I only ever had healthy volumptious syrian males and my diet worked on them. Pregnant females and young hamms are also different. Anyway, that's my imput.
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post #26 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-19-2011, 07:15 AM
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I know what the healthy diet is because I'm a breeder and have spoken to professionals about it. Yes dog BISCUITS are Okay because they are plain and have usually no real additives but full on dog FOOD is not used for them because in long term use it destroys their livers fronted high protein content. I have a link from an article about it on the other forum, when I leave work I'll paste it here. I'm on my phone.


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post #27 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-20-2011, 09:25 AM
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You should never feed rodents dog or cat food as they are high in fat and protien made for strict carnivores,
That is a pretty broad statement. Rodentia covers a huge number of species, many of which are quite opportunistic omnivores. You may wish to amend that to just Syrian hamsters.

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Rodents need fiber and vegetarian protiens with often lean meaty/dairy/nut protiens. They need fruits and vegetables, seeds, nuts, plants and vitamins/minerals aswell.
To be fair, insect proteins make up a small part of their diet and should not be discounted out of hand.

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And FYI, yogurt treats are perfectly fine, they need to just be given in moderation like many other foods.
I am sorry, but I must argue this...how is a food made out of cow's milk appropriate for an Mid-Eastern, desert-dwelling rodent?

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Hamsters have EXTREMELY sensitive tummies -_-
Likely...pet Syrian hamsters are amongst the most inbred mammals on the planet....it is bound to have had negative impact on their physiology.

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post #28 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-20-2011, 01:16 PM
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Inbreeding or line breeding is actually good if done with the the proper knowledge. Breeding nilly willy has negative effects for everything. Also rat food is what we use for many vegetarian mammals that are given to us to rehabilitate before we release them. We also give it to not so vegetarian animals like Opossums because of the general good nutrients it provides for all of them. We also give protein, fruits veg etc depending on the species. We never feed dog or cat food. Yes they all need protien in their diet but it's different and in different amounts. It is certainly not the same thing if that's what you are getting at. Listen I honestly know what I am talking about here with the hamsters, your resume in your signature doesn't make me have to agree with everything you say (no offense) I know what I know what I know as so do you. Dont tell me dog food and cat food is "okay" because they need the protein in their diet it's a totally different thing. And I didn't discount the insects, I already mentioned them before. Please do not patronize me...

And the yogurt treats aren't bad for them, they have to be a monitored treat. Horses don't find candy canes in the wild either but are given to them as monitored treats.


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post #29 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-20-2011, 02:02 PM
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Inbreeding or line breeding is actually good if done with the the proper knowledge.
No, not really. Also, bear in mind that we are starting with two tiny founding groups (the oldest of which has been inbred for 73 years), and the individuals of each were all likely related in the first place.

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Yes they all need protien in their diet but it's different and in different amounts. It is certainly not the same thing if that's what you are getting at.
Not at all.

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Listen I honestly know what I am talking about here with the hamsters,
So am I....based on studies and keeping/breeding them since 1974.

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your resume in your signature doesn't make me have to agree with everything you say (no offense)
My signature is no CV, trust me. And no, it does not mean that you have to agree with anything...your opinions are just that.

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Dont tell me dog food and cat food is "okay" because they need the protein in their diet it's a totally different thing.
Please quote me where I stated that.

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And the yogurt treats aren't bad for them, they have to be a monitored treat. Horses don't find candy canes in the wild either but are given to them as monitored treats.
They are no more healthy or natural for the horses than yoghurt is for hamsters....and if you can prove conclusively that a product containing refined sugar and fermented milk from another species is not even slightly detrimental to a Syrian hamster, I will gladly accept it.

The problem here is that I am a zoologist/biologist/naturalist, and you are a pet-keeper/breeder...there is a vast difference in our perspectives.

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post #30 of 46 (permalink) Old 06-20-2011, 02:21 PM
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No, not really. Also, bear in mind that we are starting with two tiny founding groups (the oldest of which has been inbred for 73 years), and the individuals of each were all likely related in the first place.



Not at all.



So am I....based on studies and keeping/breeding them since 1974.



My signature is no CV, trust me. And no, it does not mean that you have to agree with anything...your opinions are just that.



Please quote me where I stated that.



They are no more healthy or natural for the horses than yoghurt is for hamsters....and if you can prove conclusively that a product containing refined sugar and fermented milk from another species is not even slightly detrimental to a Syrian hamster, I will gladly accept it.

The problem here is that I am a zoologist/biologist/naturalist, and you are a pet-keeper/breeder...there is a vast difference in our perspectives.
You are right that there are different perspectives, and at the end of the day we are just looking in the best interest of the animals. Neither of us are outwardly wrong or right - it boils down to personal preference (Regarding the food, that is) But Dog Food and Cat food fed to Hamsters specifically does cause Liver Damage.
  • ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7162130?dopt=Abstract

    Also:
  • hamsterhideout.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=62271
  • britishhamsterassociation.org.uk/get_article.php?fname=journal/breeding_methods.htm

On another note yes you may be a zoologist/biologist/naturalist, but I not just a "measley pet keeper/breeder".

I am also a Wildlife/Veterinary Technician (Also in school), a Wildlife Rehabilitator, and a professionally educated Breeder, not just some Pet keeper who found a fun Hobby. I did a lot of research on my side and a lot of learning before I even considered the thought of breeding.

I spoke to a lot of people, went to a lot of conventions, shows and Animal Hospitals and spoke to many different kinds of handlers and Breeders.

Just the same as you, I am using experience and what I have learned to back myself up.

You have more years under your belt but that doesn't mean I am any smarter or dumber then you.

We can agree to disagree on whatever we want, but I want to try and respect each other and if somebody doesn't know something as much as the other it would be best to kindly teach instead of bluntly correcting as it looks condescending and can be taken as such.

Yogurt treats may not have anything the Hamster actually needs or are "natural" but its a nice TREAT in moderation (Which was my original point.)


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