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post #1 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-28-2009, 12:55 AM Thread Starter
 
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Unsure whether my rat Luna is pregnant.

Hey, im new to this forum. And i was just wondering whether Luna is preggers or not.
Heres the deal:
Ive been trying to breed her, and about 3 and a half weeks ago i got a buck, (Ned) and housed them together for around 8-10 days, after this, Luna's behaviour changed to relatively lazy, and her nipples became quite prominent, so i removed Ned, and gave him his own cage for the time being, leaving Luna to hopefully do her thing.
Alas, to this day, still nothing and she hasnt really gotten much fatter, though the nipples are even more prominent, and she stresses when removed from the cage, but then again, she hasnt begun nesting (even with ample material).
Will post pics soon.
Please help.
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post #3 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-28-2009, 11:52 AM
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i think the pregnancy is like what, 20 days? if at 15 days she didn't get a bigger belly, i doubt she's pregnant. However a first litter can be very small and perhaps go unnoticed.
I would say if she isn't pregnant maybe it's a sign she doesn't want babies!
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post #4 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-28-2009, 07:28 PM
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Boy..I am really going to sound like the Pot calling the Kettle black here...
But I really wouldn't encourage you to NOT breed your rats. So many rats end up in shelters, or just being turned out to fend for themselves. I would do ALOT of research, and find a rattery willing to mentor you.
I personally try to find homes before I plan a breeding. I would also encourage you to read up on Rat Genetics, there is a thread somewhere about it, a few probably.

How old is Luna, she appears very young, or is she just a small female. Please, Please reconsider breeding if you've purchased these rats from a pet store, you can't know thier genetic background, and some very nasty shockers could pop up.

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post #5 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 01:17 AM Thread Starter
 
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Dustette - Maybe she doesnt! Yeah, she would be around 20 days now.
Hmm, her nipples are more obvious then that photo shows, virtually completely bald around the nipples, i can see them easily.
TweedleDeedle3 - Its okay! Your honesty is helpful. Luna, and Ned both came from a pet shop, i did ask how long the breeder has been supplying them, and it was for five years prior. Though this is no real show if they are responsible or not, it is slightly more reassuring. Ive been trying to cram as much as i can in terms of net based research, as there are no breeders in the area ive just newly moved to. So you would suggest not breeding, should she not be pregnant?
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post #6 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 05:16 AM
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If you don't know what genes your rats carry you shouldn't breed them. even I know that. I was considering breeding my girls, until I found out the complications that come with breeding blue rats. I got them both from the same store at the same time but Pita is obviously older, or from a different litter. I have no idea what their genetics are. If your rats carry the high white gene, you can breed MC And that can kill them.


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post #7 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 07:26 AM
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Rats of unknown origins, like pet shop rats, are definitely not good breeding candidates. THey can carry a variety of genetic problems that you have no way of knowing about.

I had a litter of three abandoned with their mom, dad unknown. Obviously not breeder's rats (from known lines). Two of them died before they were 12 weeks old, one from what we believe to be a pituitary tumor. It was heartbreaking.

We are as gods to the beasts of the fields. We order the time o' their birth and the time o' their death. Between times, we ha' a duty. - Terry Pratchett.

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post #8 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 08:40 AM
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Hasto, If you live in the US I can probably help you find a breeder near you.
I've gotten my rats all from Rattery's near Philly PA US, Rats of Reading (no longer breeding), Paper Heart Rattery NJ (also my mentor in breedings) Big Apple Rattery in NY NY..and a few others, when I do get rats from Pet Stores, they are pets only. There is a really nice lady on this forum who also runs a rattery, Black Wolf Rattery in Southern California.
But in my opinion, no, pet store rats should not be bred, despite some claims "sometimes you have to breed to find out what pops up"
Any breeder who sells to a pet store is in it for the money, plain and simple.
There are also some really awesome rescues in Canada!

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post #9 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 11:57 AM
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I mean hasto, WHY are you breeding? is it just to get babies and see "What pops up" from your rats?
because that's very selfish, and what are you gonna do with the babies?
if there are no breeders in your area it's probably because in your area rats aren't a popular pet and you'll have trouble finding families to take them in.
Do you have space for 14 rats and to seperate males from females and how to TELL male from female properly before they can have babies again?
You don't want to create an overpopulation of rats that come from a pet store and therefore have rats that you have no idea what they carry.
Any breeder who sells to a petshop is sort of irresponsible because petshops in general give HORRIBLE care for animals (i worked at one for 2 months and quit because I couldn't take the bad care).
I say it's a good thing she isn't pregnant, and don't try to do it again!
IF you're REALLY interested in breeding and all the genetics and making the rat breed better with healthy beautiful rats (health being top priority) then find a mentor before you start!
When you don't know how to do something, usually you take lessons, and this is no exception, you need someone to teach you genetics, and you need to completely understand it before you even consider breeding!
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post #10 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 02:12 PM
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Hasto Rats gestation is any were from 20 22 to the longet 24 days in my exsperince with rats. Although if they are pet shop rats its hard to tell what is in their back ground and what problems they could have. I my self have some that are from breeders and some that are from pets shops or rescued. And I take a chance with breeding the unknown. But as Tweedel said some times you have to breed to find out. But are you ready to take on a whole litter that could be mutated and have health problems for ever? or what if they are to unhealthy and have to all be put down?
If you cant care for the ones that are born with health problems can you find them homes or place that know about rats and can care for them. What about finding homes for them all if she has 17 like one of my rats did can you care for 19 rats that includs the parents?
When I 1st started out I inishinly only wanted to breed my 2 faorit rats and keep the babies and a few of my friends wanted some. that way the boys would be with the boys girls with the girls. So I read up on how to breed and found a couple ratterys that were far away and to far to mentor porperly or sell or adopt breeding rats out to be able ot live cloer to help me and teach me so I did alot on my own. Then I meet Tweedel about 3 breedings later. And got some helpful tips. Genteics do I know them? Yes and NO. I do have to look things up as there is a lot to remember but most of it is copyed on to my files and sites added to my favorits. I do have trouble remebering all the color codes and make little saying like aa is always agouti recesive and AA is Always Agouti Dominet like that. I'm still working on some to remeber them with out looking them up but every one has there fults. Also I have some high whites that i had breed in january of last year and lucky none came to have mega and I didnt know about that untill I joined a group and they asked me and gave me more helpful links and people to contact. I'm also more of a visiula person as in I get some things but showing me I can understand things better at times.
But starting from scratch like me ground Zero is hard work and a lot of dedication. I alsways tell people who get any of my rats were their parents came from and if they were from a breeder breeder who I give them DOB info and parnent info or tell them their parents or grandparents came from a starting out breeder or a pet store or rescue but in a contract I have them sighn I have it that at lest 1 a month no longer then 3 months they keep me updated on their health so that I may keep it loged and if at any time any line has or develpos something the line will be stoped and not breed. In some cases you can fix certion things with proper breeding and some cases you cant.
You have to be really dedicated to breeding them weather it be from breeders or petstores or what not and learning and you cant learn it all in one day. 1st try just owning rats before breeding them. Learn all their allments and health problems they can have and really edgucate your self more in the proper foods to feed them so they stay healthy and other things a rat owner should know. And own them for a while get a feel for rats. There is alot of work to put into mom and dad before breeding while breeding and after mom has pups while she is nuring and weaning and after the pups are weened she needs a lot becuase moms need to re bost I call it even if its only one pup their is a lot that goes into making a life.
Granted there are proably millions of things I dont know about certion things but am willing to learn and all breeders keep them self updated on newer info that comes in and some of us even though we try to do that are still learning every day diffrent things that pop up in rats all over the world. But at lest we know the fondation and what goes into it. Basicly edgucate yourself 1st on all you can find a mentor and then after you have soked it all in that there is then breed. But if you want to just have a rat family with 2 of your favorit rats then fine but always be prepared and look up lots of stuff. Go back to the pet shop and ask them if you can please contact there breeder he or she maybe able to tell you giving him the date you got them what they have or who they mayhave in there back ground but 9 times out of 10 there gonna say there breeder is privet we cant do that and they dont do that or the breeder them self is not going to know. If she is prego and has a litter then I wish you the best of luck if she is not then please study up on it all you can 1st.
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I think you are in the wrong place buddy.
You are the weirdest cat I ever seen.
Now matter how big or small wierd or normal we or animals may be we can learn to love and get along and love is what makes it all worth wild. Becuase Beautie is in the eye of the beholder an no one is ugly or more prettyer then anything eals we are all equal. There are some ugly people and things but that is becuase man kind makes them this way do to thier actions.
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post #11 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diamond01 View Post
But as Tweedel said some times you have to breed to find out.
That is not what Tweedle said, your reading is as bad as your writing. She said:

"But in my opinion, no, pet store rats should not be bred, despite some claims "sometimes you have to breed to find out what pops up".

We are as gods to the beasts of the fields. We order the time o' their birth and the time o' their death. Between times, we ha' a duty. - Terry Pratchett.

"Men have forgotten this truth", said the fox, "But you must not forget it. You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed. - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
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post #12 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 02:48 PM
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Well then I must have miss read it then. I thout she ment breed to find out. But i am not saying breed to find out about pet shop rats. You can have rats from a breeder and breed them and there could be a surpire in the gene pool some were that pops up. But to be careful breeding pet shop rats.
But if she still choses to then I hope all goes well and she keeps them all or finds them homes. Either way all we can do is give her advice on them and help her out with the questions she asked. It is up to her to follow the advice or not, and guide her twards Rats and breeding them the proper way.
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I think you are in the wrong place buddy.
You are the weirdest cat I ever seen.
Now matter how big or small wierd or normal we or animals may be we can learn to love and get along and love is what makes it all worth wild. Becuase Beautie is in the eye of the beholder an no one is ugly or more prettyer then anything eals we are all equal. There are some ugly people and things but that is becuase man kind makes them this way do to thier actions.
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post #13 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennicat View Post
That is not what Tweedle said. She said:

"But in my opinion, no, pet store rats should not be bred, despite some claims "sometimes you have to breed to find out what pops up".
Thank you, but im sure it was just a misunderstanding and I dont think she would 'breed just to find out' herself.
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post #14 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennicat View Post
That is not what Tweedle said, your reading is as bad as your writing.
There was no call for that
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post #15 of 41 (permalink) Old 11-29-2009, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by RodentzRule View Post
Thank you, but im sure it was just a misunderstanding and I dont think she would 'breed just to find out' herself.
I would encourage you to read her other threads -- she has done this multiple times. There's no need to tell me what you think she would do, she has done it. In fact, she insists that one of these litters from unknown backgrounds contains a "new, unknown mutation" when multiple people experienced in rat genetics explained that the parents couldn't be who she claimed they were and suggested she probably had an accidental mating instead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RodentzRule View Post
There was no call for that
It's very frustrating to watch her give out misinformation over and over and over again and then misquote someone and twist their meaning to suit her purposes -- as she's done many times before.

We are as gods to the beasts of the fields. We order the time o' their birth and the time o' their death. Between times, we ha' a duty. - Terry Pratchett.

"Men have forgotten this truth", said the fox, "But you must not forget it. You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed. - Antoine de Saint-Exupéry

Last edited by Jennicat; 11-29-2009 at 03:56 PM.
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