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· Curmudgeon
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Where do you think the "ethical" food companies get the information they use to formulate their foods? You think they just have an innate knowledge of what the sodium, zinc, or selenium requirements are of puppies and kitten?

The information needed to make a healthy, nutritious diet for animals has to be acquired through animal experimentation. You can't get that information unless you get it from the animals.

If these "ethical" companies truly make nutritious, complete diets, they are using this information. They may not do the experiments directly, but they are just as involved in the process. If you ask me, it's pretty unethical to point the finger at the large pet food manufacturers, and then act holier-than-thou. While all the time, they are using the data extracted from animal experiments (often from those same manufacturers and experiments) to make their own food.

Thanks for the info, but I don't "innocently" buy my pet food. I think I can figure out which companies to buy from.

Bob
 

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Bob wasn't being hurtful with his words.He is very wise! :)

I refuse to buy Iams or Eukanuba products because the companies apparently test on beagles,but they do horrible tests on their livers and things.Being involved with beagle rescue,I just cannot bring myself to support companies like that.

Then again,I do not have my own dog right now.
 

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I agree with Lisa...I mostly agree with Lisa...hehe.
I try to avoid products tested on animals,sad sorry fact is a lot of products previously was tested on animals.[though I don't *agree * with animal testing...I'm on a lot of meds myself.Some for my asthma& bronchitis& some for sanity...]
My dogs aren't on the bestest food in the world right now [Ceaser] but it's the only thing they'll willingly eat .
Heh.They love that food so much.They are both small dogs.
When we tried to switch them before they refused to eat >_<.
 

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Melissa,Isn't "Cesar" dog food actually cat food labelled as dog food? Steph has been working as a vet assistant for a little while now and thats what she told me.

I used to feed "Cesar" to my rats on OCCASSION for a treat,but once Steph told me that,I stopped because there is way more protein in cat food then dog food.

I dunno where Steph got her info tho,but since she is working as a vet assistant right now,I guess she got it from good sources.
 

· is a little "special"
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Its CAT FOOD?! Dang! My dog :heart:loves:heart: that stuff!
 

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I think so.Thats what my cousin said and she is working at the vet's now and has learned all about foods.
 

· Curmudgeon
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we have choices. You choose to be hurtful with your words.
I'm so glad I don't.
I'm not choosing to be hurtful, I'd like to think I'm being terse. Sorry if you took it that way.

That being said, I find it mildly insulting for someone new to the board to come in and assume that we "innocently" buy our dog food. You're assuming we don't do our own research, or make educated decisions on how we take care of our animals.

In addition, there are degrees of animal laboratory studies; from the cruel to the innocuous. There are also two sides to every point of view. If you start a thread the deals with animal experimentation, animal diets, or laboratory feeding studies, you should expect that there may be some who take a contrary point, or issue a challenge to post your factual references. If you can't deal with that, you probably shouldn't post.

As far as Iams goes, I believe that most of that controversy is very old news. If you take the time to do some research, you'll find that the offenses were actually done by contractors to Iams, and that Iams has radically changed the way the do research and business. You might even contact Iams for their point of view. They have taken quite a few steps to insure that things like that don't happen in the future.

While I don't believe everything corporations tell me, I do believe that pet food companies are very sensitive to public pressure and perceptions. They may not become ethical for moral reasons, but they may do so because of economic reasons. The reason this is still floating around the internet is because radical groups like PETA, Uncaged and others have to have some kind of controversy to keep themselves relevant. JMO

bob
 

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Oh well honestly I could care less about Iams,so I never did any recent research on it.I also do not have a dog or cat right now anyway,so I have no reason to research Iams.

Thats just my opinion.
 

· Curmudgeon
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I think it's practically impossible to buy a dog or cat food that doesn't represent "some" amount of animal research. It used to all be done in labs, but many, if not most large companies use data collected from owners in their own homes, and from animal shelters. Many shelters are glad to get free food in exchange for giving the companies data on how well the food is eaten or not. Animal "testing" can mean lots of things, ...it's not all black and white anymore.

bob
 

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Melissa,Isn't "Cesar" dog food actually cat food labelled as dog food? Steph has been working as a vet assistant for a little while now and thats what she told me.

I used to feed "Cesar" to my rats on OCCASSION for a treat,but once Steph told me that,I stopped because there is way more protein in cat food then dog food.

I dunno where Steph got her info tho,but since she is working as a vet assistant right now,I guess she got it from good sources.
Your guess is as good as mine.:confused:
I def don't always go by what vets say either.
Simply because after being through 4 vets some contradicted the other.
But my dogs get check ups a nice bit& neither of them have any problems assiociated with food?
I don't think it's one of the "best" foods out there,but Baby Dusty eats it,same does Reo.
The wet & the dry food.
& They refuse to eat other things.

If someone can show me proof that this dog food is bad or cat food,please educate me.
& Give me suggestions for weaning a 10 yr old& will be 4 in September dog off the stuff.
Thanks.
 

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Well I don't know.I am just posting what I heard.MOST commercial foods are not good anyway.But I know several people who still feed their dogs commercial foods and have no problems.

And you have to keep in mind that not all vets are the same.Thats why when looking for a vet you have to kind of "shop" around.Fortunatly I know where the good vets are and the one I go to is awesome.So I have no worries there.
 

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Yeah my vet I have now is GREAT & has good morals.
Excellent guy.
He's passionate about animals& directs other people to other vets in certain situations :).

& As a side note,my "first" Dusty (dog I had before this one) was on a special diet that costed an arm& a leg pretty much that she got especially from the vet.(& I was more than willing to work for to provide,after all my responsibility.& she meant the world to me.)
Majority of my money went for her pills & food back then (& I was like 12 when she died).

So before anybody starts thinking I feed my dogs that because it's commerical food,you have another think coming.
I pay over $600 in rent& work three jobs& I don't cheap out on my pets.

I'm serious though.
If you can find ways for me to get them to eat other food regularly,cause right now they simply won't...then let me know ;).
 

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3 jobs? Wow! Where do you work? and how do you find time to yourself and your pets? Sounds like you have a super busy life! Also, with that many hours spent at your jobs, how do you find time to post on here?

~K
 

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I wasn't saying you were bad for feeding them commercial food,don't be so defensive! Jeez! I already said I know several people who feed commercial and have no problems and I am not saying because it is cheap,because it is not.NOT all commercial food is cheap.
 

· laugh often
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I've heard from a few people that cat food can rot dogs teeth afterr awhile of eating it.
 

· Will It Ever Change?
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i do concur with bob. i am against the cruel inhumane animal testing done by the beauty industry. however...just like humans, we test certain things on the user (albeit pets) to see if it's going to work or be helpful. it's important to not let your fear of something being harmful, stop you from seeing that it's helpful.
 

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3 jobs? Wow! Where do you work? and how do you find time to yourself and your pets? Sounds like you have a super busy life! Also, with that many hours spent at your jobs, how do you find time to post on here?

~K

For one I don't post here much because people snap my beeping head off I don't know what is wrong with this place.
Jeez @ you too Lisa reading too much into stuff.Stop beeping snapping back at me,FFS!

I'm currently working in a town 2 hours away @ a fish plant where I make boxes :giggle: I alternate jobs as a shift worker.But basically there& when not there I do work at an asian restaurant& I'm on a town project.
But right now since the plant soon be closed till Fall thats where I spend a lot of time,except my days "off" goes to the other jobs (so I don't get days off anymore technically,its hours off,& thats split between pets& sleep.)
& I work 10 hours.
Which is crappy.
But meh.
Myself is not important,don't give a rats...butt about myself,so all my spare time is spent with my pets.
 
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